Author Topic: what happens to a gun during a failed background check via PPT?  (Read 3163 times)

Offline caspa

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what happens to a gun during a failed background check via PPT?
« on: November 24, 2015, 06:26:38 PM »
I have a question. If I were to buy a hand gun via PPT from someone out of state and fail the backround check. What would happen to the hand gun?

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Offline SapperForward

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Re: what happens to a gun during a failed background check via PPT?
« Reply #1 on: November 24, 2015, 07:46:53 PM »
The gun gets shipped back to the seller on the sellers dime.

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Offline caspa

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Re: what happens to a gun during a failed background check via PPT?
« Reply #2 on: November 24, 2015, 08:03:54 PM »
The gun gets shipped back to the seller on the sellers dime.


Thanks for the response!! I looked everyone online and couldn't find a solid answer.

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Offline neomedic

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Re: what happens to a gun during a failed background check via PPT?
« Reply #3 on: November 25, 2015, 09:00:35 AM »
You said PPT so I assume it's private party transfer.  There should be no shipping back to original owner since it's a face to face meet and the gun must be DROSed again.
If the buyer fails the DROS, the gun will now have to be re-DROS again to the original owner.  If the original owner fails the DROS, the gun will be forfeited to the store.  The store will have a couple of options, sell it or turn it in to PD to be destroyed, etc. 

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Offline BAJ475

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Re: what happens to a gun during a failed background check via PPT?
« Reply #4 on: November 25, 2015, 04:44:00 PM »
I have a question. If I were to buy a hand gun via PPT from someone out of state and fail the backround check. What would happen to the hand gun?
Your question is ambiguous.  As neomedic said, PPT generally refers to what is known in California as a private party transfer.  Both parties must be California residents and both must be present at the FFL's place of business at the same time.  In other words, it must be a face to face transaction.  You cannot do what is generally referred to as a PPT if the seller is out of state.  On the other hand, if you were merely saying that the seller is an out of state resident, the answer depends on how the firearm is shipped into California.  If it comes from an FFL, then the California FFL could return it to the shipping FFL.  However, if it came from a private party, the California FFL could not ship it back to a private party in another state.  The only exception that I know of is where a private party ships a firearm to a gunsmith for repair and the gunsmith ships it back after the repair, ie no transfer of ownership.  Furthermore, in your case the handgun would have to be on the present roster.  I do not know of any FFLs that would accept a handgun from an out of state private party.  Too many problems and the very real possibility that the handgun would not be on the roster and could not be sold to anyone other than a LEO.

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Offline skyhawk

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Re: what happens to a gun during a failed background check via PPT?
« Reply #5 on: November 26, 2015, 08:33:42 PM »
I have a question. If I were to buy a hand gun via PPT from someone out of state and fail the backround check. What would happen to the hand gun?

You don't buy a handgun via PPT from out of state. There is no such thing. It is not legal. PPT is **ONLY** for transfers between two residents of CA, who both have valid CA state issued ID.

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Offline Ubermcoupe

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Re: what happens to a gun during a failed background check via PPT?
« Reply #6 on: November 26, 2015, 08:57:11 PM »
I have a question. If I were to buy a hand gun via PPT from someone out of state and fail the backround check. What would happen to the hand gun?

Your question is ambiguous.  As neomedic said, PPT generally refers to what is known in California as a private party transfer.  Both parties must be California residents and both must be present at the FFL's place of business at the same time.  In other words, it must be a face to face transaction.  You cannot do what is generally referred to as a PPT if the seller is out of state.  On the other hand, if you were merely saying that the seller is an out of state resident, the answer depends on how the firearm is shipped into California.  If it comes from an FFL, then the California FFL could return it to the shipping FFL.  However, if it came from a private party, the California FFL could not ship it back to a private party in another state.  The only exception that I know of is where a private party ships a firearm to a gunsmith for repair and the gunsmith ships it back after the repair, ie no transfer of ownership.  Furthermore, in your case the handgun would have to be on the present roster.  I do not know of any FFLs that would accept a handgun from an out of state private party.  Too many problems and the very real possibility that the handgun would not be on the roster and could not be sold to anyone other than a LEO.


That's almost correct - although customary, and almost always the case, a PPT does not need to be with both parties *at the same time.*

The seller can visit the FFL to drop off the firearm to be transfered before the buyer visits. Caveat being that the ffl has to be willing, and that all monies for the transaction happen outside the ffl.



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Offline BAJ475

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Re: what happens to a gun during a failed background check via PPT?
« Reply #7 on: November 27, 2015, 12:00:05 PM »

That's almost correct - although customary, and almost always the case, a PPT does not need to be with both parties *at the same time.*

The seller can visit the FFL to drop off the firearm to be transfered before the buyer visits. Caveat being that the ffl has to be willing, and that all monies for the transaction happen outside the ffl.


That's a BIG caveat!

I have never spoken to an ffl that would be willing to do a PPT unless both parties were present. I have sold 4 pistols using PPT and had to be present each time. I for one, would never give up possession of a firearm unless I had the money in hand and all of my buyers wanted to examine the firearm before parting with their money.

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Offline AR15barrels

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Re: what happens to a gun during a failed background check via PPT?
« Reply #8 on: November 27, 2015, 12:15:35 PM »
I have never spoken to an ffl that would be willing to do a PPT unless both parties were present.


I have done a few PPT's in this manner.
When you know the buyer/seller and the FFL and the FFL knows the buyer/seller, it's pretty easy to arrange to have the gun dropped off before the buyer shows up to do his side of the paperwork.

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Offline mikal1911

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Re: what happens to a gun during a failed background check via PPT?
« Reply #9 on: November 27, 2015, 12:18:57 PM »
There is a firearm background pre-check you can do at FFL to see if you qualify. It costs $25-35, but worth knowing if unsure. Things like restraining orders, violent misdemeanors, and even delinquent/unpaid parking/traffic tickets could result in denied DROS. Good luck.

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Buyer responsible for DROS/PPT fees, all items sold as-is no exchanges/refunds/warranty.

Offline mikal1911

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Re: what happens to a gun during a failed background check via PPT?
« Reply #10 on: November 27, 2015, 12:22:26 PM »
I have never spoken to an ffl that would be willing to do a PPT unless both parties were present.


I have done a few PPT's in this manner.
When you know the buyer/seller and the FFL and the FFL knows the buyer/seller, it's pretty easy to arrange to have the gun dropped off before the buyer shows up to do his side of the paperwork.


Technically that's a consignment sale/transfer, where FFL purchases/takes ownership of said firearm. The FFL then sells it to buyer, but this may result in higher transfer fees plus sales tax instead of the $35 PPT fee.

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Buyer responsible for DROS/PPT fees, all items sold as-is no exchanges/refunds/warranty.

Offline AR15barrels

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Re: what happens to a gun during a failed background check via PPT?
« Reply #11 on: November 27, 2015, 12:25:35 PM »
Technically that's a consignment sale/transfer, where FFL purchases/takes ownership of said firearm. The FFL then sells it to buyer, but this may result in higher transfer fees plus sales tax instead of the $35 PPT fee.


If you say so.
I always paid the seller directly though and the FFL only charged $35.

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Offline Ubermcoupe

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Re: what happens to a gun during a failed background check via PPT?
« Reply #12 on: November 27, 2015, 01:29:22 PM »

That's almost correct - although customary, and almost always the case, a PPT does not need to be with both parties *at the same time.*

The seller can visit the FFL to drop off the firearm to be transfered before the buyer visits. Caveat being that the ffl has to be willing, and that all monies for the transaction happen outside the ffl.


That's a BIG caveat!

I have never spoken to an ffl that would be willing to do a PPT unless both parties were present. I have sold 4 pistols using PPT and had to be present each time. I for one, would never give up possession of a firearm unless I had the money in hand and all of my buyers wanted to examine the firearm before parting with their money.


There is one FFL in socal that I know does this.


I have never spoken to an ffl that would be willing to do a PPT unless both parties were present.


I have done a few PPT's in this manner.
When you know the buyer/seller and the FFL and the FFL knows the buyer/seller, it's pretty easy to arrange to have the gun dropped off before the buyer shows up to do his side of the paperwork.


Technically that's a consignment sale/transfer, where FFL purchases/takes ownership of said firearm. The FFL then sells it to buyer, but this may result in higher transfer fees plus sales tax instead of the $35 PPT fee.


Uh, no - that would be a consignment. The KEY phrase in your response is ownership - with a PPT, the FFL never takes ownership, so it's not a consignment.
Again, this does not happen often, but there is nothing in the law that explicitly states both parties need to be present at the same time - only that it is between two parties (the individuals). The FFL cannot handle any money at anytime.



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